Did Beatty want to die?
Okay. Why would Beatty betray Montag like that? And why would Montag kill Beatty? I think that Montag could have convinced Beatty to join him. He did not have to kill him.
Do you guys think beatty wanted to die like montag thought on page 122?
Was Beatty going insane?
How would you react if you were Montag when they pulled up to burn his house?
I agree with Matt. He could have convinced beatty to joiun him!
Maybe Montag killed Beatty because he knew Beatty would not join him. 0r maybe it was because Beatty betrayed him.
Matt- I think beatty was not going insane i think he just had to much knowledge and that overloaded him because no one else had that knowledge like he did.
Tyler-I think in a way he wanted to. Earlier in the book, beatty seamed to know a lot about books and information in the books. So i think he was raised in a family where he was able to read but now that he is missing that it is like he is missing part of his life.
Tyler-I think Beatty didn't want to die, but he didn't really care if he did live. His life revolved around burning books and he died being burnt. I feel like his life was complete.
MattBeatty wouldn't have joined Montag. Beatty said previously that he had tried to read books before, but they didn't help him understand anything. This could be why Beatty hates books now.
Cody- I think he did, because this world was too much for him. This world has ravaged the land and lives of everyone in some way or another. I think that this world is a prison for the mind.
Tyler and Cody, I think Beatty did want to die, look at all the suicides in the area at the time. No one was happy at the time.
Matt- I think that Beatty wasn;t going insane he had read the books but knew there wasn't much he could do all by himself so he sat back and let things go on so he would've rather died than continue living a lie
TylerI think that Beatty did want to die and he did it the same way as the old lady that killed herself earlier in the book. I think that Beatty loves books and he saw how much the lady cared for the books as well but he didn't want to seem suspicious, he had to find a way to copy what the lady did and he chose the let Montag set him on fire.
Matt- If you think about how much literary he cited when he talked to montag it makes me think that he may have been a bit insane but the fact that everyone is so stupid so not educated and the fact that you are a smart person that may have made him insane but overall i think his knowledge destroyed him.
MAson- I also agree that he wanted to die, he didnt have the will to live anymore, and just fell apart.
Jay- if Beatty didnt care that much about dying then why did he give mantag a weapon, and why did he push Montag over the edge with anger?
Former Prime-Minister Winston Churchill, said that the wars of the future will be wars of the mind. Now would anyone agree that the war being fought here in the country, is a war for the mind? I know there isn't any real war in the country, I'm just being metaphorical.
I agree with jay2012. Beatty's life was complete. He didn't want to die but he didn't have a good reason to live.
Mason-If beatty wanted to die, why did he wait so long. Montag has been in the process of changing and then beeatty dies.
@ CoryI think that Beatty actually liked the society. I think that part of his job was to have full knowledge of what was going on but still enforce the mindless society.
Why do you think Mildred turned Montag in? She had a fairly decent life and she was desperately attached to her wall TVs. She also didn't seem completely against books.
Tyler I think that since Beatty possessed so much knowledge it caused him to see what was really going on in society so he wanted to die.
Tyler-Well I think he finished what his job in the world was and that was to burn books. If he were to live, he would have just burnt more books. So he didn't really care for the world anymore. He didn't care if he was alive or not.
Justin-If you recall, mildred attempted to commit suicied at the begining of the book. I think she put on a smile to make it seem like her life was fine but when motag started reading he didn't pay much attention to her.
Connor- he was to proud to kill himself, he had to have someone do it for him to make it seem justified.
This goes t'ward what Nick said in the inner circle. If this society is so perfect, why does this society have so many flaws?
Justin- I think she turned him in because he embarrassed her in front of all her friends and in that society your social status seems very important.
Tyler-I agree with you and i think that Beatty was willing to die because he might have been raised in a different environment than what they have had in their life.
Jay I think that i would be surprised to find that the are going to burn my house, and then i would try to stop them. I would try to find who set an alarm to burn my house, and i didn't have any books, i would find that person and burn their house because it seems that there are no cops and the firemen do things without knowing all the facts.
Justin- I think she turned in Montag because he was reading the book, and that was against the law.
I agree with Jay, Beatty was just repeating the actions daily and was like a robot. He did not care what happened because there was no joy in his life anymore.
I think that makes sense jay. Beatty was like a robot in the society and didnt care what happened tto him and what he did. He just went through the motion of everyday life.
lee- I think he was not so insane but that the knowledge overpowered him like he was mentally ill from all of the knowledge that he had.
Andy- I disagree because she was a little bit insane, and she just has a breakdown.
SeanThe society set up by past generations is trying to be as perfect as possible. But while the society is perfect the people in it are not. These people seem to thrive on violence. They have a window smasher room at the amusement parks, they aim for animals while driving and their programs have clowns de-limbing others.
@ astickaI think that Mildred probably also turned in Montag because she did not really love him. She didn't think that it was worth sticking by her husband because they didn't mean that much to eachother.
Andy-She knew that Montag had the books before now. She knew when beatty was at there house and didn't turn him in. Why did she choose now to turn him in.
Justin-I don't think that she would want to give up all the things she had. She was too attached to the TV's and she could not bare to lose them. If she was caught with Montag she realized that she might lose all her stuff. So she decided to take the safe route out and turn in Montag.
Do you guys think it's okay that Montag goes and plants books in the Blacks house even though they are innocent?
connor st.- i think that her friends persuded her mind to turn Montag in. Her one friend had two dead husbands and a divorce so maybe she told Mildred that it was ok to turn him in.
@ AndyI think she probably chose that time to turn him in because he had upset her pretty badly and insulted all of her friends and so she just hated him by that point.
Sean This society is so perfect that even if the smallest anomaly of change is presented the government wants to change it in that instant to keep the people happy so that the perfect lives that they live can stay that way but they also stop people from thinking outside the TV box and the 'relatives' is the driving force of their culture but the TV show is considered perfect and it became the people and they don't want things to change in their TV show.
Back @ Justin,OK, I see what you're saying. this society is mad and seems to run on violence. and thats really creepy about the clowns.
Tyler-That makes a lot of sense. Do you think the story would have changed if Mildreds friends were not there.
Jay- I do not think it was right but look what happened to the man that they caught instead of montag. They just need someone to blame.
JayAre they still innocent even though they burn books as well as people?
-tylersmaybe she was brainwashed by her friends to hate men, i mean i don't think two dead husbands and a divorce is coincidence. Maybe their all messed up in the head.
connor- i think it would have been different because Mildred was content with what she did everyday which was the parlor but she was so brainwashed with it that it kept her thoughts away from Montag
Do you guys think that in the book your social life and status is everything?
Lee- One of here friends had 2 dead husbands and a divorce, do you think the other one had a problem wiith men as well?
From what the inner circle just said, do you think they banned books to prevent violence?
Justin-Well your right, Mr. Black isn't innocent, but he does what he is told to do. He doesn't know that what he is doing is wrong, because that is what society has taught him. But Mrs. Black had nothing to do with any burning of books and she is going to get in trouble for no reason.
@ CodyI think it is because thats all they really have, and it seems to be there main goal in life.
Lee- I think that they banned books to prevent people from not liking violence because look at how there was the person losing his limbs on the wall they liked that so if they banned books to stop violence then why is that being shown.
-connorswell if she didn't im sure she will soon based on how her friends are. After all i think your influenced by the people around you.
CodyM-I don't think that social status is anything in the society. No one cares about who there neighbors are, and people are't affraid to turn in there own family.
Why did Montag get so much pleasure out of burning his own house? The descriptive writing style is very similar to the beginning of the books when he is still a fireman.
Codym-it is very hypocritical. When someone gets a book and another person turns them in, the gov't and fire fighhters are required to use violence and burn down the houses.
CodyI think that in the book there is no status and the social life consists of watching their TV shows with other people. Beatty said that the government wants to keep everyone happy and for everyone to be happy you would need everyone to be at the same status level and and they get talked to by the TV show and they take part in it too so they are socially accepted by watching the TV show and they watch it with others because there is nothing else to watch because this show is what keeps everyone happy.
@ Cody.Social status and rank is everything in this book. The higher you are, the more control you have.
justinb- ya that confused me as well, I would have thought that he would have been pissed the she turned him in or at least would have tried to prevent his house from being burned.
@ JustinI think he had pleasure in burning his own house because he was like burning his past and all of his old ideas. Since he burnt down his own house he felt like he could do something new.
Where will Montag go now that he is wading down the river away from the action? Will he just go to some barren place to avoid punishment? In Faber's plan, he wants him to go to St. Louis which brings up two questions. What is in St. Louis? Is it a regular society or just like this one? And also this story must take place in the USA if he just walks to get there. Why does Bradbury portray the USA as this figure?
Cody- I wonder if faber has friends in st louis and thats why Faber wants Montag to go there.
Cody Kotelko Well I think that that there in the USA but the state must be the same rules unless they split up the state's in the USA and the state makes there own rules and other stuff
Cody-I think he potrays the usa as the figure because the usa is very technologicaly advanced and he thinks that the usa is going to be the first society to have these changes.
cody m- i think faber might have friends in st louis but i think he just knows that people there and people on the way there are into books.
Cody-Maybe the war has ravaged the world so much that the continents have merged back to Pangaea the way the world was before. It is possible but I'm just spitballing.
So far, who do you think has had the biggest effect on Montag?
CodyI think the USA is portrayed in this figure to show the people reading the book what life could become. ALSO!Why do you think Bradbury reveals that this is USA so late in the book? Is this like a symbol of lost or no faith or utter indifference to onces country. Like nationalism is gone.
Justin-I think clarisse has had the biggest effect on montag because now he asks questions and wonders about things and he isnt normal any more.
Justin-Even though clarrise was not in the book for very long, i think she has had the biggest effect on montag. It was her who started hiis brain to think and look around at the rest of the world.
justin- i think the biggest effect on montag has been clarrise. she was the first person who really cared about him and she started him on his change that leads to him leaving town and reading books.
I kind of think that the movie "Surrogates" plays in here a lot. That movie and this book, both in a way deal with addiction. The firemen deal with the way things are, and in Surrogates people are addicted to their new selves and completely change who they really are.
@ JustinI think that probably Clarisse probably had the biggest effect on Montag because she started his "out of the box" thinking and influenced his actions.
JustinI think that the authors of the books have had the biggest effect on Montag because they are the one's that have furthered his thoughts on why the firemen are burning the books and how wrong it is because they have worked hard to put all those lines together.
Justin-Clarisse has definately had the most impact on Montag because she was the first person to change Montag's point of view on society. Also, since she is dead, Montag can never talk to her and ask her questions. This allows Montag to free think for himself.
justin Clarrise would have to be the biggest effect
KevinI think Bradbury does that to show how much people are disconnected from each other. They aren't really much of a country, the citizens only care about their individual needs and desires. They are going to war but its not really as a nation of united states.
I wonder from an author's standpoint, why has Ray Bradbury wrote this book up till now? What was his intentions for the audience. What message did he intend to get across?
Cody- The book was written in the early fifties and late forties when the hight of the cold war was being reached.(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_War) The fear was striking people of what a communist world would be like. I think the Bradbury placed the setting in America to try and visualize what it would be like if we were communist.
Justin-I agree with Cody because it was Clarisse who got him interested. Do you think that the death of Beatty could have had a big impact on Montag?
Off of what lee has said, do you think that this is what would happen if we were communist?